A lot of the news on this site is American news. I thought just for general interest i'd create a thread for the goings on here. I often post in the American news threads at how crazy some of the shit is. I aim to post weird and controversial news in here for Ireland. It can really be an interesting comparison of the going ons between two different political areas.

Here's one for today i found interesting in the light of the US shootings. It is an interesting comparison that at the moment anyway in the US there's been a lot of shootings recently but meanwhile here people are getting arrested for guns that aren't even real.

Makes me wonder if i'd get arrested for owning a light gun.

Quote:

Finbar Kelly and Joseph McNally in court over fake gun Two Belfast men have appeared in court charged with having an imitation gun. Finbar Kelly, from the Antrim Road, and Joseph John McNally, from Oisin House in the New Lodge, deny the charges. They were arrested when police stopped a car on Thursday and discovered a pellet gun under the passenger seat. The court heard that during a follow-up search of Mr Kelly's home, PSNI officers found a document which allegedly referred to an organisation's intent to attack drug dealers. A PSNI detective constable told Belfast Magistrates Court that police were objecting to bail on the grounds of the discovery. "This document would threaten to do harm to as yet unknown individuals in the community in relation to perceived drug offences," she said. Mr Kelly, 35, was sitting in the passenger seat of the car and 46-year-old Mr McNally was driving when they were stopped and arrested. A defence solicitor told the court the pair had denied any knowledge of the gun during police interview. He said his clients claimed the document was nothing more than a scribble on a "scrap of paper" which could not be dated. District Judge Harry McKibbin said he was "not prepared to take the chance" of releasing them. They were both remanded in custody to appear again on 28 September.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19448527

Also in the paper today i was reading this, which is pretty controversial here:

Quote:

Benefits appeal woman Cecilia Burns from Strabane has died "A cancer sufferer, who had her benefits cut by government officials who said she was fit to work, has died. Cecilia Burns, 51, from Strabane, County Tyrone, had started a campaign in February to have the decision overturned. Ms Burns had her benefits cut after she was assessed by government contractor Atos Healthcare. She had her benefits reinstated just a few weeks ago but died on Monday. 'Disgusted' During her campaign the County Tyrone woman said she was "disgusted" after the government cut her sickness benefit and told her she was fit to work. Cecilia Burns had her Employment Support Allowance reduced by £30 a week even though she was still undergoing treatment for breast cancer. Ms Burns had described the medical test as a "joke". The government is seeking to reassess all 2.6 million people on incapacity benefit - and its successor employment support allowance (ESA) - by 2014 in an effort to encourage more people back to work and to cut the welfare bill. Stormont Assembly MLA, Michaela Boyle, had helped Ms Burns in her campaign. "I have known Cecilia since she went for her medical assessment. She received nil points and appealed that assessment." Ms Boyle is critical of the assessment process. A protester in London was seen carrying a banner for Cecilia Burns at the protest outside Atos HQ A protester in London was seen carrying a banner for Cecilia Burns at the protest outside Atos HQ "Our office has been dealing with the fall-out of this on a daily basis and that is mainly with the flaws. A lot of MLAs will be facing the wrath of this. "We have been deeply critical of all aspects of the decision-making process with many claimants being disallowed who have severe disabilities, chronic conditions and life limiting illnesses. "We have questioned the objectivity of these decisions given that a large number of these decisions are being overturned at appeal stage. "At 60% of these appeals, the claimant had been awarded nil points in assessment." Last week Atos said they would be reviewing their correspondence with claimants after they incorrectly told one woman that assessors were not required to be specifically trained in mental health. Paralympic protest Later on Friday, Disabled People Against Cuts and UK Uncut will protest outside Atos headquarters in London to coincide with the Paralympics. Before her death, Cecilia Burns told the BBC that dealing with the side effects of the treatment were bad enough, but she had been angered by the cut in benefit after she went for a medical. "I know there's other people out there and they're all scared to come forward," she said. "I was treated badly. I've been working since I was 17, I've paid all my stamps, all my National Insurance. The only time I was ever sick was when I was pregnant with my two sons. "It has had a financial effect on me but it's more (that) they're getting away with it. They are just treating you like a second class citizen. That's how I feel - that I don't count, I don't matter," she said. In a statement Atos said; "We do not make decisions on people's benefit entitlement or on welfare policy but we will continue to make sure that the service that we provide is as highly professional and compassionate as it can be. "We do this through a constant programme of training and education for our staff, a rigorous recruitment process for healthcare professionals and through continual work with the Government, disability rights groups, healthcare professionals and those going through the process on the ground." Meanwhile, in Northern Ireland, Social Development Minister Nelson McCausland has organised a public consultation on the changes.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19433535

AND FINALLY for today. One in which the USA is related:

Quote:

Boston College IRA tapes case to go to US Supreme Court A legal battle to prevent interviews with an IRA bomber from being handed over to police in Northern Ireland is to be taken to the US Supreme Court. Ed Moloney and Anthony McIntyre conducted the interviews during a history project for Boston College. They claimed the move would give foreign police agencies greater power over US citizens than the FBI. The Police Service of Nothern Ireland (PSNI) is seeking the transcripts as part of an IRA murder investigation. The taped interviews, with convicted bomber Delores Price, were conducted as part of the Boston College Belfast Project which began in 2001. Ms Price was among a number of former republican and loyalist paramilitaries who were interviewed about their activities during the Troubles in Northern Ireland, on the condition that their accounts would remain confidential until after their deaths. The PSNI is seeking access to her transcripts as part of their investigation in the the IRA murder of Jean McConville in 1972, after Ms Price gave an another interview to a newspaper in which she allegedly claimed to have driven the Belfast mother of ten to her death. In July, a US appeal court ruled that Boston College interviews should be handed over to the PSNI. Dolours Price Dolours Price told a newspaper journalist she had taken part in the Belfast Project Mr Moloney, a jounalist, and Mr McIntyre who is a former IRA member, had applied to the First Circuit Court of Appeal for a rehearing the case, but this was rejected on Friday. The men said they were "disappointed" but would now apply for a hearing at the US Supreme Court because the case "addresses issues of major constitutional importance for Americans". They said the PSNI had applied for access to the interview transcripts under the terms of a Mutual Legal Assistance Treaty (MLAT) between the US and the UK. In a joint statement, the men said their lawyers would argue that "the MLAT bestows upon the PSNI greater powers in relation to the serving of subpoenas in the US than could be exercised by, for instance, the FBI. "US citizens could challenge a subpoena served by the FBI on First and Fifth Amendment grounds but are precluded from doing so in the case of subpoenas served by foreign powers under an MLAT." They added that 62 countries have signed MLATs with the US, and said some of them had "poor human rights records". Boston College is also appealing against the decision to hand over the tapes, but separately from the two men. Its appeal will be heard in Boston on Friday 7 September, and Mr Moloney and Mr McIntyre said tapes could "theoretically be handed over to the PSNI" on that date. The Belfast Project lasted five years and involved academics, historians and journalists. The researchers have consistantly argued that releasing the documents could risk the lives of people who gave testimonies and damage the peace process in Northern Ireland. Ms Price was convicted of her part in the car bombing of the Old Bailey courthouse in London on 8 March 1973. The explosion injured more than 200 people.

Today in the News:

This piece of news is around an issue which is very controversial at the moment.

Last Saturday there was a period in Belfast in which "sectarian songs" were played outside a catholic church. This is another march in which there has been problems. There's a very long history in Northern Ireland of problems with marches.

The Orange Order are basically a protestant unionist group, they march every year around July 12th. The problem is they insist on marching through catholic areas. This is where the problems lie. There is no reason why they should march through those areas but they insist on doing cause they have a right to. It's disrespectful but realistically they do it to annoy the catholics and taunt them.

This usually results in rioting. Hence the missiles thrown as in the story below.

Quote:

Trouble breaks out ahead of Belfast parade Police are at the scene of disturbances near Belfast city centre which broke out ahead of a parade organised by a republican flute band. Bricks, stones, bottles and golf balls have been thrown after crowds gathered at Carlisle Circus and Clifton Street. Diversions are in place and motorists are advised to avoid the area. There has been tension in the area since last weekend, when trouble broke out as a loyalist parade passed a Catholic Church. Seven police officers were injured in the previous disorder on Saturday 25 August. Bricks and bottles were thrown as several loyalist bands defied Parades Commission rulings and played music as they marched past St Patrick's Church. On Sunday, up to 300 people were expected to take part in the march organised by the Henry Joy McCracken Flute Band. The parade was due to begin at Duncairn Parade in the New Lodge area at 14:00 BST and travel to Henry Place near Clifton Street.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19457015

This story puts it into perspective:

Quote:

Three arrests after Belfast parade trouble Three people have been arrested after trouble broke out during a loyal order parade in Belfast on Saturday. Seven police officers were injured during disturbances after a number of bands defied rulings made by the Parades Commission during the Royal Black Institution parade. A 13-year-old boy was arrested on suspicion of riotous behaviour. He was released pending a report to the Public Prosecution Service. Two men were later charged. During Saturday's trouble a policewoman was treated for minor head injuries but was later discharged from hospital. No officer suffered serious injuries. The Young Conway Volunteers band had defied a Parades Commission ruling which barred them from marching past St Patrick's Church on Donegall Street. It made the ruling after the Shankill Road-based band was filmed walking in circles outside the same church while playing a contentious song on 12 July. At the time, the Young Conway Volunteers said it was "pure chance" that they had come to a halt there and insisted they were not playing the Famine Song, an anti-Irish song that originated in Glasgow. On Saturday, a number of bands also defied a second Parades Commission ruling by playing music as they marched past the church. A number of protesters were separated from the march by a large police presence. The trouble broke out as the last of the bands marched past the church. A Presbyterian minister in north Belfast, Reverend Leslie Carroll, said she sympathised with the congregation at St Patrick's Church. But she added: "I understand that there is a lot of anger about the Parades Commission and about the decisions that it has made. "From the point of view of the Presbyterian Church, we have always said that local engagement is the way to resolve all of these things and we would encourage that. "How we accommodate the anger or hear the anger is a big challenge for us. Nevertheless the Parades Commission is an official government body and its rulings should be obeyed." 'Undermine' North Belfast MP Nigel Dodds said that the loyal orders had seen more and more restrictions placed on them and that people have had enough. In a statement, he said the Parades Commission had "brought its own determinations into disrepute and it bears the principal responsibility for the inevitable outcome". But Alban Maginness of the SDLP said he was "disgusted" by the behaviour of the marchers saying there had been an "attempt to undermine the authority of the Parades Commission and the police". "I have to say it is a complete dereliction of duty by, in particular, DUP politicians to ignore what has happened - to defend what has happened - and to try to undermine further the standing of the Parades Commission," he added. The police have charged a 38-year-old man with disorderly behaviour and provocative conduct. An 18-year-old has been charged with disorderly behaviour and assault on police. The return leg of the parade on Saturday evening passed off largely peacefully.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19384618

Blackout wrote:

Not sure if you'd know, but I'm curious. What does Peterson of Dublin charge for their line of pipes and tobacco on their home turf? Stuff's pricey here!

I have no idea. I don't smoke that often and there are no stores up here. They have stores down in Limerick, Dublin and Cork etc. but none here. I haven't been to Dublin in a good while as well so i'm afraid i can't tell you.

Though what i've gathered is the stuff is pricey everywhere!

Today in the news!

MORE VIOLENCE. If you ever thought Northern Ireland was a peaceful nation after the Good Friday agreement the news in the last three days sure should have turned that on its head.

If you are interested there's a video of the below story here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19470390

Stuff like this is actually pretty common.

Quote:

More violence at Carlisle Circus, north Belfast There has been further trouble in the Carlisle Circus area of north Belfast, where 47 police officers were injured during disturbances on Sunday. Police have described Monday night's trouble as "serious disorder" and have warned motorists to avoid the area. About 100 loyalists have gathered in Denmark Street and 100 nationalists on the lower Antrim Road. Officers have come under attack with petrol bombs, bricks, stones and fireworks. Four water cannon have been deployed. Earlier police blamed loyalists for Sunday's trouble at a nationalist parade in the area. They said up to 350 loyalists were involved in rioting. Teenager charged A 17-year-old boy arrested during the trouble has been charged with riotous assembly, assault on police, assault causing actual bodily harm and resisting arrest. Northern Ireland Chief Constable Matt Baggott said he was seeking meetings with the Department of Justice and the Northern Ireland Policing Board following the violence. He said the community could not afford a repeat of the trouble. The first and deputy first ministers are meeting community leaders in north Belfast to discuss contentious parades in the area. Northern Ireland Justice Minister David Ford said it was too early to say whether the violence had been orchestrated. "What was clear was that there was a major difficulty with a number of people who obviously set out to cause trouble, as a result of which 47 officers were injured," he said. "That's the key concern of the chief constable at the moment and obviously the police will be following up things like CCTV evidence with a view to prosecutions." Police were attacked with petrol bombs, fireworks, bricks and bottles during hours of disorder.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/northern_ireland/

This one is a pretty common story. I've read news of these deaths about 5 times in the last few years.

Quote:

Ben Robinson inquest hears mother wanted him off pitch A schoolboy who died on a rugby pitch in NI should have been taken off at half time, his mother has told an inquest into his death. Carrickfergus Grammar School pupil Ben Robinson, 14, collapsed at the end of a match after a series of heavy tackles. His mother, Karen Walton said that by the end of the game he was staggering and forgetting he was playing. The inquest in Belfast is considering whether he was concussed at an earlier stage and should have been taken off. "I wanted Ben off at half time as I felt he was involved in too many tackles and I felt he had done his bit for the game, regardless of when he came off," Mrs Walton said on Monday, recalling the match in Carrickfergus between Ben's school and Dalriada School in January last year. State pathologist Jack Crane believes Ben died from Second Impact Syndrome - two heavy knocks close to each other which caused swelling in the brain. School friends have given differing accounts of his behaviour during the match - with one claiming he was "knocked out" at an earlier stage and should have been taken off, but others saying he assured them that he was okay. Mrs Walton said she felt uneasy. "I wanted Ben off. I heard Ben shout 'I am not remembering this, I am not remembering playing'. I shouted at Ben 'Are you all right?' I don't believe he heard me calling him." The referee looked over to her and told her to calm down, the inquest heard. Mrs Walton added: "He was less than 10ft from me, he was swaying and shaking his head as if to clear it. He had his arms straight out to the side, he was staggering on his feet. "I realised something was very wrong, that he was not engaged in play, and I shouted 'Ben, are you all right'? My son turned and said 'I don't feel right'." Mrs Walton said at the end she saw a player on the other side of the pitch on the ground. She knew it was her son. She ran over and he was pale and had tears in his eyes as he lay on the ground. He was making a rasping noise. His mother placed her coat over him and told him she was there. Consultant neuropathologist Brian Herron said he believed Ben was concussed at the end of the game when Mrs Walton was talking to him. "The other evidence does not convince me," he told the inquest. He had particular difficulty with evidence from a schoolboy spectator that Ben was knocked out earlier in the game, pointing out that he had changed his description and had become uncomfortable when questioned. Dr Herron said when Ben did not know the score that did not mean he had forgotten it and may have just been concentrating on the game. He said being wobbly after a tackle was par for the course, according to other expert evidence. The inquest continues.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19469818

Today in the news. The big news is really a continuation of what's been happening the last few days in response to the parades.

The news about midday today was:

Quote:

Police chief urges action as violence flares in Belfast A senior police officer has challenged politicians to sort out the parades issue before someone is killed. Assistant Chief Constable Will Kerr was speaking after a second night of violence - believed to be mainly loyalist - in north Belfast. More than 60 police officers were injured and seven hospitalised. ACC Kerr said he feared someone would be killed unless the violence in the Carlisle Circus area stopped. In the run-up to the loyalist Ulster Convenant parade on 29 September, he said: "Northern Ireland cannot afford an eleventh hour solution." On Monday night, petrol bombs, bricks, fireworks and stones were thrown at police. A van was hijacked and pushed into police lines. Two police officers were knocked unconscious by thrown missiles and another suffered a broken arm. ACC Kerr said he did not believe the violence was officially sanctioned by any loyalist paramilitary groups. But he said members of these groups had been involved in the trouble. "The community of north Belfast needs to see a resolution to this issue now," said ACC Kerr. "Collectively, we cannot afford to wait and we cannot have night after night of violence on our streets." He challenged politicians and community leaders to "sort this out, and sort it out now," ahead of the planned Covenant parade. On Monday, loyalists gathered in Denmark Street and republicans on the Antrim Road. Four water cannon were deployed by police. The area returned to calm at about 03:00 BST. Seven people were arrested, and ACC Kerr said there would be more to follow. Assistant Chief Constable Will Kerr said the violence meant the 'time for posturing has passed' On Sunday night, 47 police officers were injured during disturbances in the same area, following a republican parade. Police said up to 350 loyalists were involved in rioting. It has been claimed the loyalists were angry that the republican parade had no restrictions placed on it by the Parades Commission, which makes determinations on contentious marches in Northern Ireland. ACC Kerr said: "The huge impact on Northern Ireland cannot be ignored. “this is a community backlash which has been building for some time” Winston Irvine North and West Belfast Parades Forum "As we strive to promote our positive image, the negative effect of these violent pictures on jobs, tourism and investment cannot be underestimated. "We do not want to take a backward step. I urge all those with influence to urgently use it to bring a resolution to the violence and work towards a longer term solution for the issues affecting this area." Alban Maginness of the nationalist SDLP told the BBC on Tuesday there was "nothing spontaneous" about the rioting. "The bulk of the violence over the past two days has, I believe, been sustained by loyalist paramilitaries," said the North Belfast assembly member. "I think this is an attempt to intimidate the lawful authorities." Winston Irvine, of the loyalist North and West Belfast Parades Forum, dismissed as "sheer rubbish" claims that the violence was orchestrated by paramilitaries. "The violence is unacceptable but it's also very understandable why people are so angry," he told the BBC. "This is a community backlash which has been building for some time." The chairman of the Northern Ireland Police Federation, Terry Spence, paid tribute to the officers on the front line. "Their bravery and courage is in stark contrast to that of the cowardly thugs responsible for trying to murder them," he said.

There's a small analysis section in this article which explains why this situation is so serious.

Quote:

Mark Simpson BBC Ireland Correspondent The outbreak of violence is a stark reminder that parts of Belfast are still heavily divided. The so-called peace walls - more than 40 of them - which keep Catholics and Protestants apart are a concrete monument to Northern Ireland's bitter history. The spark for the trouble in north Belfast was a parades dispute. This is no surprise. The marching issue remains the biggest thorn in the side of the peace process.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19483426

That article was really on trouble from Sunday night and Monday night. However it's nearly 1am at the moment and a new article was updated an hour ago stating that there has been trouble tonight as well. Third night in a row.

Quote:

Missiles thrown at police during north Belfast trouble A number of fireworks and other missiles have been thrown at police lines during disturbances in north Belfast on Tuesday evening. The police moved in after a crowd of around 200 people gathered in the Denmark Street area around 22:00 BST. A police inspector was injured on the hand during the disturbance, which lasted about an hour. It is the third night of violence in the area which erupted as a result of tension surrounding a parades dispute. More than 60 police officers have been injured and seven hospitalised during the disturbances. A water canon was moved into the street at 23:00 BST but was not used. A short time later the crowd of loyalists dispersed and police began scaling down their operation. Earlier on Tuesday, a senior police officer challenged politicians to sort out the parades issue before someone was killed. Assistant Chief Constable Will Kerr was speaking after a second night of violence - believed to be mainly loyalist - in north Belfast. ACC Kerr said he feared someone would be killed unless the violence in the Carlisle Circus area stopped. On Monday night, petrol bombs, bricks, fireworks and stones were thrown at police. A van was hijacked and pushed into police lines. Two police officers were knocked unconscious by thrown missiles and another suffered a broken arm. Four water cannon were deployed by police. The area returned to calm at about 03:00 BST. Seven people were arrested and ACC Kerr said there would be more to follow. ACC Kerr said he did not believe the violence was officially sanctioned by any loyalist paramilitary groups. But he said members of these groups had been involved in the trouble. He challenged politicians and community leaders to "sort this out, and sort it out now," ahead of a planned loyalist Ulster Covenant parade on 29 September. On Sunday night, 47 police officers were injured during disturbances in the same area, following a republican parade. Police said as many as 350 loyalists were involved in rioting. It has been claimed the loyalists were angry that the republican parade had no restrictions placed on it by the Parades Commission, which makes determinations on contentious marches in Northern Ireland. Winston Irvine, of the loyalist North and West Belfast Parades Forum, dismissed as "sheer rubbish" claims that the violence was orchestrated by paramilitaries.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19483426

There's a lot of reiteration but essentially it's a new article.

The problem with the parades i stated in an earlier post has been such for a long time. At least throughout my whole of my life anyway. I remember in the mid 90s there being problems with people marching back then and the problems still exist now.

Personally the problem doesn't really effect me. I live in Greater Belfast and although there there is trouble such as rioting, throwing fireworks and bricks etc. it is a lot less common. However the areas they talk about like Carlisle Circus is very close to where i went to grammar school and it's an area which is very close to the city centre. The church as well which is referenced is basically in the city centre and for perspective is about a 5 minute walk away from Carlisle Circus. The area is basically on the divide between a Catholic and Protestant area. Apparently the area used to be a lot worse. At the moment it's not too bad looking but it's really bland monotonous council housing. Some of the housing doesn't have gardens and also some of the housing has large fences outside it. So if you walk out the door you have essentially a line of footpath and then a high metal fence. Basically walls to stop people attacking houses.

The problem is a serious one though and it needs resolved. In this country politicians tend to sidestep the issue hence why it still hasn't been addressed and why people are calling for the first minister and deputy first minister to have a say on the issue.

I personally think the parades should be done away with but the issue isn't that simple. If you were to say one party had to have their parades regulated there would be violence from the other side and vice versa. That's basically why there is violence at the moment. It's anger from loyalists (read as protestants) who are angered that the republicans (read as catholics) do not have stipulations placed upon their marching.

It will be interesting to see what they will do.

EDIT: Also this article from the guardian sheds more light on the issue:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/sep/04/police-hurt-northern-ireland-riots?newsfeed=true

Quote:

Nearly 1,200 Ulster police officers have been injured over the past seven years in riots related to the type of loyalist marching dispute currently raging in north Belfast, the Guardian has learned. The Police Federation of Northern Ireland said the casualty figures, which include 62 officers hurt over the past 48 hours, showed that police officers on frontline duty in the province stood a one-in-four chance of getting injured in riots. As the Police Service of Northern Ireland (PSNI) braces itself for possibly a third round of rioting in the Carlisle Circus/Lower Antrim Road area, the organisation representing rank-and-file officers said that, even leaving terrorism aside, their members were under more threat on the streets than any other force in Europe despite policing in the time of the peace process. Responding to two nights of violent disorder during which loyalists attacked PSNI lines with petrol bombs, fireworks, golf balls, bottles, bricks and other missiles, the Police Federation described the number of casualties between 2005 and today as "an appalling indictment". A spokesperson for the Federation in Northern Ireland said: "The actual odds on frontline officers getting injured in these riots who are working in the Tactical Support Group (the PSNI's riot squad) may be even higher than one in four. There will be instances in this figure of 1,200 of officers being very unlucky; of a single officer getting injured a number of different times in different riots. However, we believe the vast majority of those injuries are related to individual policemen and women who are attacked in these parade-dispute riots. "Where is the political will to solve these disputes, because the price in terms of police officers injured in far too high? Police officers have human rights too and it is time the politicians took that on board while they seek to resolve this problem." The PSNI's press office said it could neither confirm or deny the casualty figures which the Police Federation insisted were an accurate picture of the price their members were paying in disputes as far flung as Drumcree in Portadown and the current controversy in the north inner city of Belfast. Tension remains high in the Carlisle Circus/Lower Antrim Road area, with loyalists linked to the Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) and the Ulster Defence Association (UDA) holding a protest on Tuesday night against what they claim were oppressive police tactics over the past 48 hours. The latest trouble flared up on Sunday afternoon following a republican flute band parade near a local Orange Hall close to the loyalist Lower Shankill estate. Loyalists claimed that no restrictions had been put on the republican march. Republicans counter-claimed that loyalists unilaterally attacked their rally, sparking two nights of sectarian disorder. The violence close to loyalism's Belfast heartland reflects the confused and unstable state loyalist paramilitary movements are currently in. Despite both the UVF and UDA being on official ceasefires, factions of the two movements have continued to engage in low-level violence and criminality. Until recently most of the UVF and UDA's violence was directed against internal enemies in their own Protestant communities. However, there are fears among the security forces that the UVF in particular is being forced by its rank and file to eventually confront dissident republicans who have a growing presence in north Belfast. Senior police commanders have avoided stating that the UVF or UDA is officially sanctioning the attacks. However, Assistant Chief Constable Will Kerr confirmed on Tuesday that individual members of those terror groups were involved in the violence. Kerr warned that someone could be killed unless all sides pulled back from the brink. Commenting on a forthcoming loyalist rally at the end of this month to mark the 100th anniversary of the signing of the Unionist Ulster Covenant in 1912, Kerr said: "Northern Ireland cannot afford an 11th hour solution." He also challenged local political leaders to "sort this out, and sort it out now" before the Ulster Covenant Day on Saturday 29 September. This latest instability along one of north Belfast's sectarian faultlines dividing working-class Protestant and Catholic communities continues just as the new Northern Ireland secretary, Theresa Villiers, take up her post. David Cameron's latest appointee to the position arrives in the city at a time of simmering sectarian tensions. The short-term roots of the current trouble go back to 12 July when a loyalist flute band from the Shankill Road was caught on camera playing sectarian tunes outside St Patrick's Catholic chapel en route into Belfast city centre. The same band and others then defied a legal ban on them playing sectarian songs outside the same church on 25 August during another loyalist rally. But the deeper antecedents of the violence can be traced back to the disconnect between the compromise hammered out between unionist and nationalist politicians at Stormont and the ongoing divisions on the ground between deprived Catholic and Protestant communities in areas such as north Belfast where there are few signs of any peace dividend.

AND WE'RE BACK. In the news today:

BEES HAVE BEEN STOLEN
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20048147

Quote:

Bees and beehives stolen from Delamont Country Park Bees Beekeepers said their prime concern is the welfare of the stolen bees Beekeepers in County Down have been stung for hundreds of pounds by thieves who stole four beehives, complete with colonies of bees, from a public park. The theft took place at Delamont Country Park near Downpatrick, sometime between 15 October and 20 October. Members of the local beekeepers association at the park say the hives are valued at around £500 in total. However, they have told police that their prime concern is the welfare of the stolen bees. Anyone with information about the theft is asked to contact police at Downpatrick on 0845 600 8000. Alternatively, details can be passed anonymously to the independent charity Crimestoppers on 0800 555 111.

and on a much sadder note, the farewell to analogue television. I will miss teletext.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20048154

Quote:

Northern Ireland completes UK digital TV switchover How BBC Northern Ireland viewers saw Ceefax say goodbye after 38 years The analogue TV signal in Northern Ireland has been switched off, completing the UK's transition to digital broadcasting. It was the last UK region to switch off its signal, bringing an end to the 80-year-old transmission technology and heralding the dawn of the digital age. It means anyone watching TV with an analogue signal lost all their channels and Ceefax at 23:30 BST on Tuesday. A joint broadcast marking the event was shown on UTV and BBC One NI. The hour-long special programme, The Magic Box, was hosted by Eamonn Holmes. The show was billed as a nostalgic celebration of "the best of Northern Ireland television over the past 60 years". The programme featured contributions and clips from many well known faces from UTV and BBC Northern Ireland, including Gloria Hunniford, Patrick Kielty, Jackie Fullerton, Gordon Burns, Julian Simmons, Rose Neill, Paul Clarke and Noel Thompson. Speaking as he closed the simulcast programme, Mr Holmes thanked viewers for watching and said: "Here's to the next 60 years." Northern Ireland's most successful Olympian, Dame Mary Peters, was given the honour of switching off the UK's last active analogue transmitter at Divis Mountain in Belfast. She described it as "a great privilege". The digital switchover also spells the end for BBC Ceefax, the world's first teletext service, after nearly four decades. Launched in the days before the internet and 24-hour rolling news, the aim of Ceefax was to give viewers access to the latest news, sports results and weather as soon as it came into the BBC's newsrooms. On Tuesday evening, a series of graphics on Ceefax's front page will mark its 38 years on the BBC. Switchover advice Viewers who need information on how to update their TV equipment in order to access digital channels and digital text services should call Digital UK on 08456 50 50 50 for independent advice. Separately, the BBC runs a Switchover Help Scheme to help older and disabled people with everything they need to switch one TV to digital. For more information, call free on 0800 40 85 900 or visit the website. Those already using digital TVs or set-top boxes will have to re-tune. However, if you have Sky TV, Virgin Media, freesat or Freesat from Sky on all your TV sets, then you do not have to do anything as your service will not be affected by the change.

Cactus wrote:

Bloody hell, N. Irish tv has only just gone digital? Had it for years here in Wales.

We're still in the stone age here. In technology, politics, in everything haha.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20587538

....and tonight parts of Northern Ireland burn.

What could cause such an act?

A decision has been made to promote equality in this country for both sides that the Union flag will only be flown at certain times of the year.

The response to equality?

To riot and cry that it's not being flown every day of the year.

If you ever needed an example of what sectarianism is. This is it.

..and 6 days later the rioting has continued on a daily basis.

I thought i'd post some short videos to show what it is like here at the moment. The seriousness of this situation cannot be underestimated. It has been stated as an attack on democracy, which it basically is. Again i reiterate this is a good example of sectarianism and you will also see the total idiots that inhabit this country and who cause the problems.

Here Hilary Clinton visited us recently about the peace process, only to bare witness to this total bumblefuck.
[YT:16803e8c2f]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTiIO8FyHn8[/YT:16803e8c2f]

Here is the root of the problems. An attack on City Hall.
[YT:16803e8c2f]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEnmz84DFcQ[/YT:16803e8c2f]

...and finally this one is meant to be funny. Sad thing though is this street is one of the ones with all the pubs on it that i go to visit. I'll be down here tomorrow so i may take some photos.
[YT:16803e8c2f]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5U3gdjGbP0[/YT:16803e8c2f]

Again to illustrate the seriousness:

Quote:

"Hopefully it is a temporary thing, but the perception here (in Dublin) is that Belfast is in flames and not a place to go to at the moment," he said.

Drew Linky wrote:

Holy crap, all of this over how often a flag is waved each year? People get so upset over the weirdest things, when you stop to take a look at it.

Yup.

They are claiming that by a flag not being flown from a building for 365 days a year that their British identity is being destroyed.

It can quickly and easily be explained as to how retarded these people are.

For example.

They are literally destroying cities across the country, they have diverted trade and tourism, they even protested in the middle of the city on one of the busiest shopping days for businesses. They are destroying this country just so they can have their identity which makes no sense even in itself.

I cannot state how stupid and oblivious most of these protesters are. They have zero clues about what they are even protesting about. Anyone on this forum who has googled the issues in N.Ireland would know more than these people.

They have been flying banners saying Ulster has always been British. Despite the fact that the plantations were only in the 16th century, that Ulster is an Irish word and that Ulster has been one of four Irish kingdoms since the beginning of Irish history.

Not to mention the biggest fuck up of all on their part that three of the counties that make up Ulster are not even in fucking Northern Ireland. So they are claiming that three counties belonging to the Republic of Ireland are British.

This is what i mean when these people have zero fucking clues. You could have googled this and realised this. They are literally hoodlums and terrorists.

Look at these videos, they want their flag to be flown yet they protest with their faces covered....and you know what is worse?

Some of these people sit in our government. People with these dangerous views and ideas. We literally have terrorists who govern this country.

But on top of all this what is infuriating most of all is this:

I am going to explain exactly what happened and you can work out for yourself why this is such a fucking travesty and why these people are idiots.

Northern Ireland is "at peace". There was trouble for about 30 years in this country. An agreement was signed and politicians from both sides now endeavour to work together.

To understand this i need to explain how parties work here very briefly. There are unionist and nationalist parties or protestant and catholic parties. There is a religious element to this but it is mostly political and related to identity and culture. There are also mixed parties.

Unionist parties are allied to the UK such as the Democratic Unionist Party DUP and Ulster Unionist Party UUP.

Then there are nationalist parties such as Sinn Fein and the Social Democratic and Labour Party SDLP (which is sort of mixed but is basically a nationalist majority).

There are then parties which are mixed which are the Alliance Party and the Green Party.

There is an idea put forward in the signing of peace that a shared future is to be strived for aka that people of both communities can live together.

There are problems with this, parts of the city are still very divided along political/religious lines aka there are parts of Belfast which are still very catholic and others very protestant.

The parties which are polarised even though they are meant to strive for a shared future still have their own priorities - hence why they are divided as nationalist and unionist.

So catholics vote for the catholic parties and protestants vote for the protestant parties because they are protecting their own ideals and cultures.

I should also mention that Catholics in holding onto ROI regard themselves as Irish while Protestants generally state themselves as British.

Interestingly for myself i was raised a protestant, i hold a British passport, yet i support a United Ireland and regard my nationality as Irish which is the opposite of how my views should go. In that i am non-religious as i am sure you have gathered i vote for the mixed party.

Onto this issue however.

So basically with the shared future thing flags fly from government buildings aka City Hall and Stormont (our parliament). The flag that flies is the Union Flag aka the flag of the United Kingdom ONLY.

So what has happened is that the nationalist parties aka Sinn Fein and SDLP have said that the flag is insulting to Irish people and that it shouldn't be flown.

Now obviously the reaction from the DUP and UUP has been that if you remove the flag you are removing our identity.

When it comes down to it the idea that removing a flag from a building is dissolving your identity is fucking idiotic but welcome to Northern Ireland.

However what has happened is that the third party the Alliance. Stated well since we are a mixed party we do not support their argument. We think the Union Flag should be flown to please the Unionists but only on certain days of the year - aka British Holidays and dates of relevance.

That way it is fair.

Unionists get the flag on some days.

Nationalists don't get the flag on some days.

So it was a fair agreement and what has resulted is what i have discussed above.

People bombing and destroying the Alliance offices calling them betrayers even though they were trying to make it equal for all.

Now i can understand how unionists are mad because it seems like they are getting gyped because they can't fly it every day but this is the price for equality. At least you are getting to fly it all!

So people have been out rioting because of this, burning cars, attacking the police who are trying to keep the peace.

Now that is a crash course in N.Ireland politics but perhaps you can see how that through democracy and promoting equality that people have just became destructive.

We live in a democratic society and people cannot deal with the results. Imagine in the USA people rioting in the cities because Obama won. That is how a democracy works. Just because you don't get your own way doesn't mean you get to wah wah wah.

...and again what totally perplexes me is how people are so against equality for everyone. These people are literally holding this country back.

/rant completed, i'll be surprised if anyone reads it, probably won't make much sense to anyone here.

Methid Man wrote:

I was going to ask why the decision that has triggered the violence was made, but your last post explained everything nicely. So basically the parties that represent the British (or protestants) wanted to make things fair for those who identify as Irish (or catholic) by flying the UK flag less often. Sounds alright to me. But the Brits (or DUP/UUP to make more political sense) are now pissed it's not flown every day. In trying to "protect" their identity, they resort to burning cars and bombing buildings, which is only ruining their identity they so cherish. Yes, I can see the irony here.

Close, i may have made a typo.

The British parties don't care at all about equality. As long as the union flag flies 365 days a year they could care less that the Irish people are being shit on. (the same is arguably true for the Irish parties).

It was the mixed party, Alliance Party that proposed the alternative that it should fly only on certain days. The catholic party didn't want it to fly at all

To make it simple.

The Brits want it to fly every day.
The Irish want it to never fly.
The mixed party went for the alternative in that it should fly but only on certain days - so the middle ground.

Yet it is the people who picked the middle ground who are getting the grief.

I also didn't mention this which should be noted (albeit it may confuse matters).

That this was a council decision and not a parliamentary decision (so imagine a state making a decision as opposed to the federal level). This may be slightly confusing but basically the geography of here works in that we have counties and then the whole country. The councils basically work within counties but there isn't like a county organisation as there may be in the states so basically there could be more than one council in one county, aka i live in County Antrim and there are there is more than one council here e.g. Belfast, Newtownabbey etc.

The council is like local government basically. I mentioned other parties when describing the major parties in this country but the only parties involved in the decision making on this issue where DUP, SF, SDLP and Alliance.

SF and SDLP for removal altogether.
DUP against
Alliance middle grund.

The votes were actually tied between the parties aka Catholic vs Protestant.

It was Alliance who made the deciding vote but only on their compromise. Alliance could have said okay we vote for nationalists, the flag should never be flown but they didn't.

They picked the option which was fair to both sides in line with their parties policies.

Then the unionists somehow think they have been cheated out of it.

I guess it is understandable though since the nationalists outnumbered the unionists.

EDIT: I also must clarify that it isn't the politicians or any of the political parties that are involved in the attacks for the most part.

The parties have their views and they stick by them. They are not responsible for the violence but the common people aka protestants in Belfast and across Northern Ireland who do not agree with the sentiments.

There have been urgings by the politicians in a number of protestant parties telling them to stop:

Quote:

Northern Ireland First Minister and DUP leader Peter Robinson said all unionists wanted "the folly" of what was happening on the streets to stop, but said it would be hard to persuade those involved in violence. "People who are so proud of the flag that they have to cover their faces I think are going to be very hard to reach," he said. "We'll talk to those organisations that we know are there who may have influence on the street and a lot of them are already working to try and calm things down. "But there is no rationale - how do you call yourself a loyalist and then throw a petrol bomb into the back of a police car, it's absurd." The NI secretary of state said those involved in the recent violence were "dishonouring and shaming the flag".

It's gotten to the stage that this issue has reached out of our level and over to central government in London where it has been raised in the houses of commons.

It really does paint you the picture of how low life these people are when the actual British government condemns them as they have said "they are shaming the flag".

EDIT 2: Actually if you want to see the state of affairs

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20686612

Go onto that page and watch the Naomi Long MP video, it will explain all.

She is one of the Alliance MPs, she has been sent death threats and her offices have been bombed.

She explains the whole situation nicely. It complements what i have said now that i have outlined the parties.

Apparently as well a policewoman sitting inside a police car outside her offices had the door of the vehicle opened and a petrol bomb thrown inside.

That action is being treated as attempted murder.

She also makes a point in the video which i haven't addressed and it is ironic in a way.

What does the Republic of Ireland and Britain have to say about this?

Well as usual not a lot. Britain (aka England, Scotland and Wales) (yes another interesting point, people call themselves British in this country but in fact Northern Ireland is not in Britain, hence why the British passport says Britain and Northern Ireland) don't really give two fucks about what goes on here.

This is why she calls for leadership.

Isn't it a bit ironic that people in this country so desperately are clinging onto their British identity yet the countries which they have allegiance to doesn't give two fucks about them?

Like they really don't care about what goes on here. They just really stay out of it.